Don't forget your hybrid boys Moeller and Hines. They are really SSs. Tatum type Roverbacks in this defense.

Now are you trying to tell me that offering Oliver, Pentello, Johnson, and Domicone were complete waste of scholarships and that they will never see the field and add any depth?

Also, in watching the spring game, this walkon kid Maxwell did not only catch a nice INT and get YAC, but showed other good protection too. Please respond.

Good blog, I'm not sure Paterson was that highly recruited, I think he had an notre dame offer, but when he committed, I remember being underwelmed, everyone said he was a JT recruit, think he had strait A's! Both you and I thought he might red-shirt and move down to LB.

O'Neil is another story, this guy was suppose to be a star, people said he would be better than TGII. He had plenty of opportunities.

What also surprises me is how few safetys we've had under JT. Many multi-year starters.

-KC & AR are 3.5 year starters
-Nickey/Doss both 4 year starters
-Salley beat out Mitchell and was average for 3 years
-Whitner played at nickle his freshman year and was awesome for the next 2 years as a starter
-There were very few 1 year guys: Allen, Mitchell, O'neil, but not many!

Seems like the safeties either take early or never.

I cannot completely disagree that our depth at Safety is limited however only in regards to experience. Domincone and Johnson show promise but have no reps (other than Johnson's spring reps). It has been said that Barnett could play Safety but perhaps we have a greater need for him at CB. Then as mentioned perhaps Brown can move to Safety. Then of course Wood is a good pickup at the position. Thus I do not see us being in terrible shape for this year. Then of course if we add Joyner and Hagan next year it would only serve to enhance depth.

I thought we heard a lot of good things about Johnson in the Spring. He has limited experience3, but he would be in the same boat as Howard at CB.

Duane - what do you think the problem is at Safety. With JamO, if you cold just let him play instinctive football, he had all the tools. But put him into the OSU scheme and he was a liability. Patterson, going into 2006, was the only DB we had that was a sure lock - fast and smart. One game against NIU put him on the bench for the rest of his career. He didn't even come back fully on special teams until more than halfway through the season. OSU seems to have had a roster full of guys like Gant and JamO who can kill someone in run support or on kickoff returns, but they cannot play in coverage.

Where are they missing on these guys? Is it in the recruiting, or do they really not know who is going to respond until they get into the game?

I thought we heard a lot of good things about Johnson in the Spring. He has limited experience3, but he would be in the same boat as Howard at CB.

Duane - what do you think the problem is at Safety. With JamO, if you cold just let him play instinctive football, he had all the tools. But put him into the OSU scheme and he was a liability. Patterson, going into 2006, was the only DB we had that was a sure lock - fast and smart. One game against NIU put him on the bench for the rest of his career. He didn't even come back fully on special teams until more than halfway through the season. OSU seems to have had a roster full of guys like Gant and JamO who can kill someone in run support or on kickoff returns, but they cannot play in coverage.

Where are they missing on these guys? Is it in the recruiting, or do they really not know who is going to respond until they get into the game?

I don't think O'Neal was a very good football player. He was always such a tremendous athlete. He never showed me any instincts. It was the right offer. I

Overall I have to say snakebit. I think going off the board was something I would not have done, but is worked great at other positions so the staff had every reason to think it would work at safety too. All-Americans weren't doing anything for us. O'Neal and Patterson just didn't pan out. Look what happened with Clifford. I likely have a different blog post today if he doesn't make a complete mess. Deciding to go early on Oliver was a bit premature. It was not too long after he accepted the offer that he ran a time that only an offensive lineman would want in a combine. Wait a few weeks and maybe they don't make that offer. He was coming off a great season though. He was a kid that seemed to play his best when his team needed it most. Hindsight is 20/20. Mostly I just see it as series of unfortunate events.

I still argue that we watch OUR safeties too much and see their mistakes without putting it in context of safety-play in general. During football season, the safety position is responsible for 3 out of 4 ESPN play of day highlights - and almost always in a negative way. I still remember the laments that Doss couldn't cover to save his life! If he hadn't been such a ferocious hitter he would never have been the Buckeye legend he is.

We have recruited, and gotten, big-time safties. Devon Lyons could have gone to Michigan, Miami Fl, or Notre Dame. Brandon Underwood was a CB/S prospect with ND and PSU offers (he later starred at Cincy and will be in Packers camp soon), everyone knew Jamario O'Neal could grow into a safety and, like you said, Eugene Clifford.
These guys didn't work out so lesser-known guys stepped up. Coleman was another ATH/possible S prospect. Jenkins was recruited at S and was AA in a year he played alot of S. Nate Salley and Brandon Mitchell were mostly solid (1st and 2nd team all-B10, repectively) as was Russell before his injury. So the only "problem" I could imagine is that the HS All-American safties we recruit are not becoming college All-American safties, our other recruits are.
If Coleman and Russell left the program tomorrow the starters would probably be Jermale Hines and "Mr. Spring" Orhian Johnson. I feel OK with that. Next year add Jamie Wood and Corey Brown (more blue-chippers, the latter the very definition of an ATH/possible S), Zach Domicone and maybe Christian Bryant to those two and I think we'll be fine.

the contrast between corner and safety is stark.

OK, what contrast factors? Why?

Recruiting: agree CB recruiting results have been far better, which includes CBs that play S here [Whitner, Coleman]. However, 3 recruiting basics 'we all know'...but need to remind overselves over again. First, HSes often put a super player at S [in a 'roverback' role] who's a college CB, for the same reason they put their best athlete at QB: best impact on team performance. And second, JT has long recruited 'big fast' HS DBs and converted them to college OLB's; lately, 'star'. Third, we seem to forget our cravings for 'big' and 'hitter'...in between cravings.

Scheme. Note the absence so far of the basic 'we all know': JT first recruits players to fit his scheme preferences. And of course we remember our own mantra "stop the run first". Who is 'the extra man' added 'when we need it' to 'stop the run'? Yep, we all know. Why was Doss a 'sudden impact' player when some of his man coverage skills were...downright poor? And we 'noticed' when Doss made INTs...so that made him a 'good coverer'? Nope - we judged on our 'noticings' instead of by the criteria for 'sound coverage skills'. Did saying 'average man coverage & open field tackling skills' 'dis Our Man Doss? Only if you 'felt that way'. There's a tad more to football than a subset of skills.

Ohio State does not DEVELOP 'great safeties', especially as judged by 'fan notice' because our safeties don't START unless our coaches feel they are "reliable". That means, that they consistently play the assignments given them, and subjectively do two things. First, "avoid and minimize mistakes". Second, "don't give up the big play". That job description is precisely 'reactive', and negative. It is NOT going to 'garner notice' of the postive kind. Neither is it going to develop your open field and coverage skills.

It 'gets you' sobriquets like "too late Nate" ...when those naughty opponent 'force' our DB's into man coverage. The fact that that's competively 'the idea'... seems to escape us, because we all know we 'focus' on "have to be who we are" to "have our identity".

and so...we are just as expected. What S...or CB, for that matter, can effectively cover a moving WR crossing zones...with guys 'staked out' in their zones?

this spring, OZ article described how JT talked to Russell "for an hour" and "didn't mention" that last Texas play. Stealing Duane's recent phrase used on some players: sometimes even great people "don't get it".

OK with that. Next year add Jamie Wood and Corey Brown (more blue-chippers, the latter the very definition of an ATH/possible S), Zach Domicone and maybe Christian Bryant to those two and I think we'll be fine.

barnett will move to safety by the end of the year, johnson and wood provide depth there as well. Joyner will be part of this class. That gives us Joyner and Howard as the future at CB with Clarke as a reserve. And Johnson and Barnett as the future at safety with Wood back there as well. This is a stacked secondary. I figure with all the competition Corey Brown is going to end up on the offensive side of the ball.

Duane makes a pretty good point. The 2010 team is going to be absolutely loaded at every position except for Safety. While I think we'll miss Kurt Coleman, I think Russell is relatively easy to replace (good player, not great). I really hope Jamie Wood is the real deal and picks up the D quickly. If so, it could be Wood and Ohrian Johnson as our starters. Domicone may be the darkhorse here. I also like your idea of letting Corey Brown get some reps at S just to see if that's his best position.